I'm currently trying to translate どんつー教の野望. It looks like it goes into Romanji as Dontsuu Kyou no Yabou. I haven't found a definition for 教 by itself, but it looks like it compounds to several religious words (monotheism, atheism, Islam (which is most telling, since it's Islam Kyou)). The best translation I can think of is Stomping Religion's Ambition or maybe Ambition of the Stomping Religion. Although "Stomping" could also be "Dull Pain" and "Ambition" might be "Treachery". And Religion is just my best guess for Kyou.
Help! TheWP 19:33, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- Since どんつ is the sound of Alice pounding nails into the dolls into the trees, I would go with "The Hopes of Those Who Believe in Hammering" Where どんつー教 = religion/doctrine of hammering/those who hammer, and 野望 = ambition, aspiration, design. TheTrueBlue 19:48, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- Actually, ごっすん (gossun) is the sound of Alice pounding nails into the dolls into the trees. どんつ translates to "Dawn To" and is the sound of Alice stomping. I'm not a Japanese translator; just someone who's listened to Marisa Stole the Precious Thing way too many times. jpp8 19:55, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
Actually, in the lyric page of Marisa stole the precious thing, どんつー is described as a dull pain or a stomping sound. Maybe "The Hopes of Those Who Believe in Stomping"? I prefer hammering myself, but I can't find どんつー as a pounding or hammering sound. TheWP 20:05, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- Maybe I'm just anal with the distinction of pounding and stomping TheWP 20:07, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- Ahh you're right, I had confused it with ごっすん. I would say どんつ could be "Hearthrob" ala dokidoki as dontsu could be a heavy throbbing pain. Here is a video of what dontsu sounds like: http://reaktorplayer.vodspot.tv/watch/2545605-dontsudontsu So it's a matter of translating that idea into English. TheTrueBlue 20:26, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- Well, I think どんつ refers to the どんつ in the original Marisa Stole the Precious Thing. It's really the flash movie that makes me lean towards stomping (since Alice is stomping (well, running) in the video). I know in other songs with sound effects in the title, they often just aren't translated. Maybe, "The Hopes of Those Who Believe in Dontsuu"? I'm struggling with these last three translations. TheWP 20:37, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- In that flash movie I took it to be her heart that's pounding, both from exertion of chasing a magic broom and from romantic anxiety, but it's up to you. TheTrueBlue 20:42, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- Ok, I think I've got it. "The Hopes of Those Who Believe in Heartache" Sound good?TheWP 20:54, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
- With 野望 = ambition, aspiration, design - how about "The Hopes and Dreams of the Followers of Heartache" TheTrueBlue 21:12, October 1, 2009 (UTC)
Remaining Translations[]
The only two things that still need to be translated are ごっすんしていった結果がこれだよ and やけどしちゃってもしらないぜ.
For ごっすんしていった結果がこれだよ, I recognize Gossun shite itta kekka ga kore dayo. Gossun is a pounding sound. If I remember correctly, shite is "to do". Itta... I'm not sure. I think its a verb form. Kekka is result or outcome. Kore is "This". And "Dayo" is sort of like "you know" at the end of a statement. I don't think I've ever seen Kore without a noun ('this pen') unless it is at the beginning of the sentence ('This is'). So, well, I really have no clue how to put it all together.
For やけどしちゃってもしらないぜ, I recognize Shiranai (don't understand/don't know) and I recognize the Ze as a Marisa thing. I have no clue how to parse yakedoshichattemo though. Yakedo is a burn or scald. Shicha appearantly has something to do with clothes, which doesn't fit. I also have Chakka, which might be the regular form of Chatte. On the plus side, Chakka translates into ignite or to catch fire, which makes sense with Yakedo. If it is Chatte, then I have a lone shi. I don't think shi is a particle, but the only definitions I know are death or 4. And then there is mo, which I'm not sure if it's part of another word, it's own word, or a particle. Can't mo be used like 'also'?
I really need to learn some more Japanese. TheWP 02:24, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- ごっすんしていった結果がこれだよ = past progressive/perfect (had done/finished something) tense of gossun + 結果 Result + が (is, emphasis on what "is" is pointing to) + これ (this) + だよ (standard copula, informal of desu) = THIS is the result of all that hammering!
- やけどしちゃっても = even if it/you/he/she was burned, しらない = I don't care! (within this context), ぜ makes it rough and tomboyish so: Even if it/you/he/she was burned, I just don't give a damn!
- (This might be cooking related (vis a vis the song subtitle of BBQ), it can also mean to be abandoned, like dumped by a girlfriend, or it can also mean to be jealous, curiously also meanings attributed to the expression "to be burned" in English. As for whether it's a he/she/it the lyrics should reveal that. Although I'd wager it's Marisa saying "who cares if Alice was burned by my abandoning her, I don't give a damn!" Very tsuntsun. TheTrueBlue 02:54, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- So ごっすん is pound/hammer, して is to do something (to pound), and いった makes it past tense? Then 結果 would make it into 'the result of pounding/hammering'? If これ is just being used for 'This is', why isn't it at the beginning of the sentence like I normally see in these situations? i.e. これがごっすんしていった結果だよ
- I don't really need this information to finish these translations, but I want to get better at translating. Maybe we should translate this one to "The Result of All That Hammering is THIS"?
- So for the other line, やけどしちゃってもしらないぜ, やけど is burn, どしちゃっても is even if he/she/it (does どしちゃっても break into separate words, or is it a single word that translates to a phrase?) So what would be 'even if I'? I didn't realize しらない could also be 'don't care'. Japanese really overload their words. I guess this one could be 'Even if She was Burned, I Don't Give a Damn'? TheWP 14:27, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- Watch more shows, dramas, variety, anime, morning musume, sumo matches, whatever. The "mo shiranai!" expression is something any Japanese speaking child would know of. As for the first sentence, it puts more emphasis to put "kore" at the end. Like unveiling a magic trick tada! KORE DAYO! KORE! As for your other question "shite" is suru since gossun is one of the many words that can become a verb by adding a form of suru to the end, yes ita makes it past tense o.0 lol dude you don't even know THAT?
- Well either way, watching more shows is the fastest, funnest, and most enduring way to learn all this kihon na koto. "X mo shiranai" = I don't care about X. If the expression mo shiranai is just expressed alone it usually indicates intolerable frustration or annoyance by the speaker. Like if your little sister can't talk you into quitting smoking and she just gets so frustrated she gives up (for the moment) she'd say "BAKA ONIICHAN! MO SHIRANAI!" and stomp off.
- Learning these phrases in context will give the best idea of how they "feel" with regards to the rest of the language. Only by lots of exposure can you begin to strengthen those ever important fundamentals. Anyway, good luck. I've already wrote my recommendations in the previous edits on this talk page, have fun editing. TheTrueBlue 17:25, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- Well since I feel kindly inclined towards a fellow learner of Japanese, I'll further add that "mo shiranai" is from the verb 知る shiru or to know, so loosely translated it means "I don't know you/it anymore!" or "We're stangers! (Meaning I have no obligation/desire to be bothered by anything related to you/it anymore). As for the "kore" at the end of the sentence, if you say kore first, then explain what it is about "kore" the topic is, then that is what will linger in the listener's mind, but if you END with "kore" then the thing itself is what will instead be most emphasized. Alright that's enough for now. TheTrueBlue 17:32, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- You'll have to excuse my translation skills. I don't really have a head for learning languages. And yet I keep trying. I actually have a minor in Japanese language and culture. Verb forms mess me up badly. When a verb is only two characters long, and then you drop the second character for a different character, well, the root of the word isn't that helpful when only the first character stays the same. I'm familiar with shimasu and its past tense shimashita. I know they're from suru (which makes no sense to me, but, oh well). I'm not familiar with shiteitta. Is it the nonformal version? As for mo shiranai, I always thought it was mou, since isn't that like 'geez'? I think I learned too much formal speaking and not enough colloquial. With やけどしちゃってもしらないぜ, isn't that all present or future tense? Sorry for so many questions. I actually learn better trying to translate these phrases than I do watching shows. I watch plenty of anime, but I suck at properly hearing the Japanese. And my vocab pool is rather pitiful.TheWP 17:57, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- There are many kind folks, including native speakers at this URL who can help you - http://forum.koohii.com/viewforum.php?id=4
- As for me, I've already done more than my fair share for someone who doesn't say thanks. And that's my American bluntness on top of my Japanese disdain for ingrates. Good luck. TheTrueBlue 18:06, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- Ouch. I think normally one would say thanks at the end of the conversation. Which seems to be done now. So, thank you for your help, and I'm sorry that I offended you. I really am grateful.TheWP 18:12, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- No harm done. Just a difference of values where etiquette might be concerned. I can't read your mind and how grateful you are over the internet, it's like telling your loved ones you love them everyday whereas a great many people neglect to. Not trying to be condescending, just raising a parallel in another area where things might be better if people were more mindful. TheTrueBlue 18:34, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- To get back on track, and away from my incessant tangential questions: I like the translation "Even if she was burned, I don't give a damn". Particularly the double meaning of 'being burned'. Maybe, I'm just being too literal, but やけど is a noun 'a burn, a scald'. And as far as I can tell, やけどしちゃってもしらないぜ is completely in present or future tense. So wouldn't it be closer to translate as 'Even if she gets a burn, I wouldn't give a damn'? That doesn't sound right to me though. Am I being to literal with やけど being a noun? Maybe 'Even if she's burned, I wouldn't give a damn'? 72.90.87.6 20:05, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- That was me. I wish my login wouldn't keep expiring TheWP 20:08, October 2, 2009 (UTC)
- Ok, I'm just going to put up that translation for now. If anyone feels the need to correct it later, please do soTheWP 22:16, October 3, 2009 (UTC)